no biotin if you take thyroid medication. It is used to do the test for TSH etc in the lab and any extra in your blood will skew the results. That one I do know but wanted to know if there is any benefit for other people or is it a marketing idea that it helps hair and nails.
From what I’ve read, biotin works for hair IF you have a legitimate biotin deficiency. Otherwise, no. And ditto on it affecting labs as Margaret mentioned.
I was never told about it until recently. I took a B complex vitamin for years which had biotin in it. The new endocrinologst told me not to take any for at least 4 days before the test as biotin is used to do the test in the lab which means the measurement of thyroid levels would be skewed if any biotin and was told it did not matter how much biotin is in a multivitamin or Bcomplex.
I don't take supplements because of all the reasons you state--it's snake oil and a bunch of hooey, and dangerous hooey at that. But what about when one is prescribed by one's MD/ARNP provider, such as folic acid or B12? How can I trust that what I am getting from my pharmacy (I'm in the US) is actually what it is supposed to be and is safe? Do pharmacies have a better, safer source for something that can also be OTC, like folic acid or B12 supplements?
Thank you for this. I am a former supplement junkie, I totally bought into them being safe and natural.
Now I do the bare minimum (b12, d3, dha and iodine), vetted by consumerlabs.com as you once recommended. As with claims from beauty products, it’s mind-boggling (and angering, for myself) that intelligent people like us can so easily get seduced.
Thanks for writing this. I have seen what some workout supplements have done to people, namely adding to jitteriness and anxiety. Not pretty.
In a future article I’d like to hear how we should reason about supplements that seem less predatory. It’s my understanding that B12 and folate can counteract high homocysteine levels from taking fibrates. Can we trust a manufacturer like Thorne to test as well as they say they do?
It does, but the supplements don't always contain the amount listed on the label. Maybe Thorne does, but if one has to take a statin, pharma does it better.
I have adrenal cancer and it really bugs me when I am using google for some info and have to wade through so many websites about "adrenal fatigue". It does not exist and if you are paying someone to treat you for it ,you are getting scammed. Believe me, if your adrenal glands don't work you will land in a hospital, confused, uncoordinated, possibly vomiting. They will check your ACTH levels and if they are through the roof you KNOW that your body is screaming for cortisol!
I'm so sick of the commercials about Balance of Nature Fruits and Vegetables. They are high quality commercials, so that makes it look like the product is really good. Also, I wonder how many older people are buying them based on those commercials and not eating real fruits and vegetables anymore.
Thank you Dr. Gunter. This is a very important topic. Consumerlab.com is another resource for info on supplements. They provide independent scientific testing and reviews of supplements, herbs and nutrition products/claims. I often turn to them when researching supplements. You have to pay to become a subscriber, but the cost is nominal.
I have mentioned them before and also Consumer Reports. Some libraries have a subscription to Consumer Labs. I find some of their articles about supplements a little wanting because their business model depends on people wanting to take a supplement. So I would use them for testing purposes only.
I responded to your other comment about ConsumerLab, and this is a point very well-taken, that their business model depends on people wanting to take supplements.
But if I was going to take one, I’d be more comfortable knowing they said it had the stuff they said was in it.
And also I had/have heard people talk about not trusting generic medications, but wasn’t sure what make of it, and after reading what ConsumerLab say they found in looking at some of them--I now understand the mistrust. (Not to mention learning what the FDA calls “regulation.” 🤬)
But ... again, you make an excellent point. Ultimately they (I hope inadvertently) endorse and give more legitimacy to the whole complex / industry, etc.
Perfect. The exact kind of source I was looking for. Thank you! (And not being on insta, her webpage is great if others are interested: https://labmuffin.com/archives)
Could you address dermatology offices and where quality information can be found assessing best practices? I’d love fewer wrinkles and age spots, but for reasons you often cite, I don’t trust what the practices are hawking. But I also don’t know where to find evidence based info on skin care.
While I've known that supplements have been unregulated, I had no idea it was this bad!! What I am hoping to learn if Dr. Gunter chooses, is how efficacious Jamison vitamins are. I have been taking calcium and Vitamin D for decades. I now take Vitamin B12 and magnesium. The calcium was "prescribed" by my doc, the Vitamin D due to low levels from blood tests, the Vitamin B12 'cause I'm over 70 and the magnesium because I have had lifelong muscle cramps and spasms as long as I can remember and now I have none. I am hoping Jamison vitamins are good quality. They are my go-to brand.
Wow!! 😯 thank you for this!! Cant wait to read the follow up. Supplement questions i have: b12 (why are most 10,000% more than rda??), collogen, creatine, protein powders (naked whey). The usp labels. Examine.com site to track safety of supplements. Magnesium is also a “hot” supplement today. Thank you!!!
From what I know about B12 it’s an absorption issue. That is why the amount is so high. There are also two different forms of b12, methyl and cyanocobalamin. I am vegan and use this a resource, I think anyone could benefit from the well researched info - https://veganhealth.org/
Holy Moly - this was a great post that I hope you expand on! Thank you. Even as a natural skeptic it is easy to get 'sold' on some of these things, especially, as you point out, by medical professionals. It is also hard to research supplements as a lay person because we can't really evaluate the 'studies' either. Please continue this thread if you are so inclined - what a racket!
You had me at “death-strewn backstory,” but I salute these sentences:
“...I want to review the backstory about how supplements became such a shit show in the United States. (There is no other way to describe a capitalist venture with zero regulation that has killed people and ruined lives).”
One of the issues I have with B12 - due to several autoimmune and other gut issues - is poor uptake, even when taking a sub-lingual version. Injections/infusions of B12 are far more readily absorbed for me (per blood tests).
Do you have thoughts on this? Are there any others you’d recommend for delivery this way?
This is fantastic, thank you. I’m curious about prenatals for pregnancy and breastfeeding. It’s a time of life when supplementation is necessary, but is the multivitamin necessary? Or just individual folate? And are the brands regulated? In this case dose is hugely important. Curious to hear your thoughts. Thanks!
What really fascinates me is the delivery systems for the supplements; whether gelatin or vegetarian capsules, there is just no way that having a big handful of those on a daily basis can be good for you. When I open my nightly Mg (2 capsules) and my melatonin (1 capsule) to pour into juice or my a.m. CoQ10 & multivitamin, the amount of leftover hard material is shocking. I think it is one of those things like all of the gums in food (gellum, agar agar, xantham, carrageenan, etc.) where the manufacturers get away with adding it to their individual product because the FDA considers them "generally safe in small quantities." The problem, of course, is when it is in everything, it is no longer being consumed in small quantities. Same thing with supplements: fine for one or two capsules a day, but when you get up to 10 supplements twice a day, that seems like a lot to ask of your gut. No surprise that colon cancers is on the rise and increasing in younger people.
I would like more information on biotin, B12/6 as well as collagen. Thanks
Yes my GP recommended Biotin and Magnesium for migraine prevention and I was skeptical if there is any research to support this.
no biotin if you take thyroid medication. It is used to do the test for TSH etc in the lab and any extra in your blood will skew the results. That one I do know but wanted to know if there is any benefit for other people or is it a marketing idea that it helps hair and nails.
From what I’ve read, biotin works for hair IF you have a legitimate biotin deficiency. Otherwise, no. And ditto on it affecting labs as Margaret mentioned.
My Derm MD has me taking biotin, so my endocrinologist had me stop it for a week (was it 2? I forget) before getting my TFTs done.
I was never told about it until recently. I took a B complex vitamin for years which had biotin in it. The new endocrinologst told me not to take any for at least 4 days before the test as biotin is used to do the test in the lab which means the measurement of thyroid levels would be skewed if any biotin and was told it did not matter how much biotin is in a multivitamin or Bcomplex.
I don't take supplements because of all the reasons you state--it's snake oil and a bunch of hooey, and dangerous hooey at that. But what about when one is prescribed by one's MD/ARNP provider, such as folic acid or B12? How can I trust that what I am getting from my pharmacy (I'm in the US) is actually what it is supposed to be and is safe? Do pharmacies have a better, safer source for something that can also be OTC, like folic acid or B12 supplements?
Yes, exactly. I could say, nope, not doing it, but then doctors recommend some.
Thank you for this. I am a former supplement junkie, I totally bought into them being safe and natural.
Now I do the bare minimum (b12, d3, dha and iodine), vetted by consumerlabs.com as you once recommended. As with claims from beauty products, it’s mind-boggling (and angering, for myself) that intelligent people like us can so easily get seduced.
Agree!!
There are so many physicians who have gotten on the supplement bandwagon though. We want to believe they can figure out the science of supplements.
Thanks for writing this. I have seen what some workout supplements have done to people, namely adding to jitteriness and anxiety. Not pretty.
In a future article I’d like to hear how we should reason about supplements that seem less predatory. It’s my understanding that B12 and folate can counteract high homocysteine levels from taking fibrates. Can we trust a manufacturer like Thorne to test as well as they say they do?
A doctor I know is always praising Thorne. She's currently recommending their Red Yeast Rice for lowering cholesterol.
Red yeast contains a statin.
It does, but the supplements don't always contain the amount listed on the label. Maybe Thorne does, but if one has to take a statin, pharma does it better.
Agreed. I wouldn't go the red yeast route if I had a cholesterol problem.
Hmm
I have adrenal cancer and it really bugs me when I am using google for some info and have to wade through so many websites about "adrenal fatigue". It does not exist and if you are paying someone to treat you for it ,you are getting scammed. Believe me, if your adrenal glands don't work you will land in a hospital, confused, uncoordinated, possibly vomiting. They will check your ACTH levels and if they are through the roof you KNOW that your body is screaming for cortisol!
I'm so sick of the commercials about Balance of Nature Fruits and Vegetables. They are high quality commercials, so that makes it look like the product is really good. Also, I wonder how many older people are buying them based on those commercials and not eating real fruits and vegetables anymore.
Thank you Dr. Gunter. This is a very important topic. Consumerlab.com is another resource for info on supplements. They provide independent scientific testing and reviews of supplements, herbs and nutrition products/claims. I often turn to them when researching supplements. You have to pay to become a subscriber, but the cost is nominal.
I have mentioned them before and also Consumer Reports. Some libraries have a subscription to Consumer Labs. I find some of their articles about supplements a little wanting because their business model depends on people wanting to take a supplement. So I would use them for testing purposes only.
I responded to your other comment about ConsumerLab, and this is a point very well-taken, that their business model depends on people wanting to take supplements.
But if I was going to take one, I’d be more comfortable knowing they said it had the stuff they said was in it.
And also I had/have heard people talk about not trusting generic medications, but wasn’t sure what make of it, and after reading what ConsumerLab say they found in looking at some of them--I now understand the mistrust. (Not to mention learning what the FDA calls “regulation.” 🤬)
But ... again, you make an excellent point. Ultimately they (I hope inadvertently) endorse and give more legitimacy to the whole complex / industry, etc.
Perfect. The exact kind of source I was looking for. Thank you! (And not being on insta, her webpage is great if others are interested: https://labmuffin.com/archives)
Thank you for this info. I'm not on Instagram either (don't even really know what it is...)
I love Lab Muffin.
Could you address dermatology offices and where quality information can be found assessing best practices? I’d love fewer wrinkles and age spots, but for reasons you often cite, I don’t trust what the practices are hawking. But I also don’t know where to find evidence based info on skin care.
I think that @Labmuffin is a great source for skin care science so I would check her account out on Instagram, this is not my area unfortunately
Yes, LabMuffin is wonderful. ❤️☺️☺️
I like Dr. Idriss very much. You can check her out. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCidfBdauHUmKFcMw-4QoaSw.
https://www.idrissderm.com/about/
And I second Dr. Gunter on @Labmuffin
Another vote for Labmuffin.
Oh I love Lab Muffin!
While I've known that supplements have been unregulated, I had no idea it was this bad!! What I am hoping to learn if Dr. Gunter chooses, is how efficacious Jamison vitamins are. I have been taking calcium and Vitamin D for decades. I now take Vitamin B12 and magnesium. The calcium was "prescribed" by my doc, the Vitamin D due to low levels from blood tests, the Vitamin B12 'cause I'm over 70 and the magnesium because I have had lifelong muscle cramps and spasms as long as I can remember and now I have none. I am hoping Jamison vitamins are good quality. They are my go-to brand.
JAMIESON! Not Jamison. Oops.
Wow!! 😯 thank you for this!! Cant wait to read the follow up. Supplement questions i have: b12 (why are most 10,000% more than rda??), collogen, creatine, protein powders (naked whey). The usp labels. Examine.com site to track safety of supplements. Magnesium is also a “hot” supplement today. Thank you!!!
From what I know about B12 it’s an absorption issue. That is why the amount is so high. There are also two different forms of b12, methyl and cyanocobalamin. I am vegan and use this a resource, I think anyone could benefit from the well researched info - https://veganhealth.org/
Holy Moly - this was a great post that I hope you expand on! Thank you. Even as a natural skeptic it is easy to get 'sold' on some of these things, especially, as you point out, by medical professionals. It is also hard to research supplements as a lay person because we can't really evaluate the 'studies' either. Please continue this thread if you are so inclined - what a racket!
You had me at “death-strewn backstory,” but I salute these sentences:
“...I want to review the backstory about how supplements became such a shit show in the United States. (There is no other way to describe a capitalist venture with zero regulation that has killed people and ruined lives).”
One of the issues I have with B12 - due to several autoimmune and other gut issues - is poor uptake, even when taking a sub-lingual version. Injections/infusions of B12 are far more readily absorbed for me (per blood tests).
Do you have thoughts on this? Are there any others you’d recommend for delivery this way?
(This infusion happens in my MD doctor’s office.)
Yes I have questioning thoughts about B-12 as well and the shots -- especially in the case of a certain 90 yr old woman I know.
This is fantastic, thank you. I’m curious about prenatals for pregnancy and breastfeeding. It’s a time of life when supplementation is necessary, but is the multivitamin necessary? Or just individual folate? And are the brands regulated? In this case dose is hugely important. Curious to hear your thoughts. Thanks!
What really fascinates me is the delivery systems for the supplements; whether gelatin or vegetarian capsules, there is just no way that having a big handful of those on a daily basis can be good for you. When I open my nightly Mg (2 capsules) and my melatonin (1 capsule) to pour into juice or my a.m. CoQ10 & multivitamin, the amount of leftover hard material is shocking. I think it is one of those things like all of the gums in food (gellum, agar agar, xantham, carrageenan, etc.) where the manufacturers get away with adding it to their individual product because the FDA considers them "generally safe in small quantities." The problem, of course, is when it is in everything, it is no longer being consumed in small quantities. Same thing with supplements: fine for one or two capsules a day, but when you get up to 10 supplements twice a day, that seems like a lot to ask of your gut. No surprise that colon cancers is on the rise and increasing in younger people.